|
Post by King98er on Mar 14, 2007 15:30:05 GMT -5
from ESPN.com
Pete Rose revealed Wednesday that he bet on the Reds "every night" while he was manager of the team and that the Dowd Report was correct when it said he did so.
ESPN Radio
RoseAppearing on the Dan Patrick Show on ESPN Radio, Pete Rose said he bet on the Reds to win every night while he was their manager because he believed in his team. Listen
Rose spoke Wednesday with Dan Patrick and Keith Olbermann on ESPN Radio to discuss the new Pete Rose exhibit that will be on display at the Great American Ballpark as part of the Reds Hall of Fame. The exhibit will be on display for 11 months.
"I bet on my team every night. I didn't bet on my team four nights a week. I was wrong," Rose said.
Rose said that he believed in his team so much that he bet on them to win every night.
"I bet on my team to win every night because I love my team, I believe in my team," Rose said. "I did everything in my power every night to win that game."
Rose accepted a lifetime ban for gambling in 1989, but denied for nearly 15 years that he bet on baseball. He finally acknowledged in his latest autobiography, published in January 2004, that he made baseball wagers while he managed the Cincinnati Reds.
Rose said he doesn't worry about getting into the Hall of Fame anymore, but if he is reinstated, he hopes to manage again in the majors.
"I quit worrying about it," Rose said about the Hall. The former Reds great said that he thought he was going to be reinstated when he met with commissioner Bud Selig before his book came out. Rose said he met with Selig about a year before the book came out and told him everything that was in the book.
"I really thought I was going to be reinstated. Something changed [Selig's] mind," Rose said.
Rose said he believes it should be up to each individual owner whether he should manage in the majors again.
"[It's] all about dollars, Dan and Keith. If I was ever reinstated. If an owner don't want to win and draw people, don't call my number," Rose said.
Major League Baseball's Hit King also said he thinks that Mark McGwire is getting a raw deal from the writers voting for the Hall of Fame. The reason he said he supported McGwire is because nothing has been proven and they're all "allegations."
"Don't penalize McGwire because you think other guys are taking steroids," Rose said.
McGwire wasn't voted into the Hall of Fame in his first appearance on the ballot in January because of allegations he used performance-enhancing drugs in his career.
Rose admits he made a mistake in betting on baseball.
"I made a big mistake. It's my fault, It's nobody's else's fault," Rose said. However, he said he should be reinstated because "I'm the best ambassador baseball has."
Because of the ban, Rose is not eligible for induction into the Reds' or Baseball's Hall of Fame. He also is not allowed to be involved in most on-field activities, which has prevented the Reds from retiring his uniform No. 14.
Major League Baseball did include him in two events -- 1999's All-Century Team and 2002's 30 Memorable Moments -- that were sponsored by a credit card company.
The new exhibit includes more than 300 items from the career of Rose, who finished playing in 1986 with a record 4,256 hits. His total is reflected at the Reds' Hall in a three-story high wall of baseballs -- one for each hit.
The Associated Press contributed to this report.
|
|
|
Post by 9 on Mar 14, 2007 15:35:40 GMT -5
Maybe this would have mattered if he admitted it in 1989. Now? So what? He's a dope.
|
|
|
Post by thecaptain15 on Mar 14, 2007 16:09:32 GMT -5
I think most of us already knew this knowing how Pete is and how he thinks.......I wonder if he bet against Kane all those years at Wrestlemainia...
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 14, 2007 16:11:41 GMT -5
In other news, OJ killed his wife.
|
|
$heriff Tom
Administrator
Groom ba ya ya ya
Posts: 16,173
|
Post by $heriff Tom on Mar 14, 2007 17:55:26 GMT -5
Balls, you idiot, the story is not "Pete Rose admits betting on baseball" - the story is he changed his story, and is claiming he bet the Reds every single night. If this was true, he would come out cleaner than if he picked and choosed which games to bet as manager.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 14, 2007 18:43:02 GMT -5
Wake me when he's reinstated.
In other news, Bill Clinton cheated on his cunt wife.
|
|
|
Post by globix on Mar 15, 2007 3:02:10 GMT -5
In other news, Bill Clinton cheated on his cunt wife
As did Newt. As did Rudy. Or is it different because their wives were not cunts?
|
|
|
Post by Chris on Mar 15, 2007 4:34:01 GMT -5
"I'm the best ambassador baseball has" -- Pete Rose
Yeah, I think Yogi Berra, Bob Feller, Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Sandy Koufax, and a host of others might have something to say about that.
Ya know, it's not that Pete Rose bet and it's not that he bet on baseball and it's not even that he bet on (or against) his own team that bothers me most about him. It's his arrogance coupled with his stupidity. I mean 4000+ hits aside, he is not a smart man, and when really stupid people come off as arrogant it just compounds the dislike factor exponentially. I think Rose has a place in the HOF, but I'm not all broken up about the fact that he is being made to suffer because from his asshole haircut to his lack of command of the English language, I just find him to be a truly objectionable human being.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 15, 2007 6:03:20 GMT -5
Their wives not being cunts certainly have no relevance. But Bill's wife being a cunt just was worth mentioning one more time.
Meanwhile, outside of politics, Pete Rose still belongs in the HOF, and his not being there is still a joke.
|
|
|
Post by IronHorse4 on Mar 15, 2007 11:17:51 GMT -5
This is actually further proof that he doesn't belong.
He bet on games in which he had a direct impact on. The fact that he bet the Reds to win every single game (which is just the latest in a string of changing stories) is irrelevant.
This is a man who had incredible debt. A compulsive gambler who owes thousands and he doesn't once...not ONE TIME...use his direct influence to rig a game and guarantee an outcome? Not once?
That's like saying a guy's shoe size grows from a 10.5 to a 13 and he never took growth hormones.
Pete Rose is right where he belongs -- excluded.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 15, 2007 11:32:09 GMT -5
It's not proof that he doesn't belong in the HOF. It's proof that he shouldn't be a manager. It's never been even alleged that he bet on baseball as a player.
4256 hits is why he belongs in the HOF.
|
|
|
Post by Chris on Mar 15, 2007 13:41:35 GMT -5
Balls has a point. I don't think Pete Rose has ever done anything in his managerial career to warrant induction to the HOF even if there were no betting....but as a player, his numbers speak for themselves...he belongs.
BUT...as I said earlier, I have NO disappointments in him NOT being in there because, quite simply, he's a douche bag and I get a nice laugh at his expense that he's being "dissed"
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 15, 2007 14:44:41 GMT -5
He's a douchebag with 4256 hits though. Ty Cobb was a bigger douchebag.
|
|
|
Post by Chris on Mar 15, 2007 15:44:19 GMT -5
Funniest line from Field Of Dreams
"Ty Cobb wanted to play, but none of us could stand the son-of-a-bitch when we were alive, so we told him to stick it!"
|
|
|
Post by drock2006 on Mar 15, 2007 18:45:30 GMT -5
How does this make this fraud any cleaner? Let's take the guy at his word and say he did bet the Reds every night. The Dowd report says he didn't but lets say Pete actually is telling the truth here. He never said he bet the same amount every night. Let's say Pete lost three in a row and tripled his bet the fourth night, whats to stop him from having a starter stay in over a pitch count, keeping a reliever in, etc?
Or lets say the money line one night was Reds +260 vs , say, Reds -130...anyone think pete is managing the same game?
Come on..hes a disgrace. Anyone that bets on baseball nightly picks and chooses when to double up and triple up bets. Anyone who thinks good ol pete was betting the same amount every night is clueless. he was/is a pro gambler
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 15, 2007 19:16:40 GMT -5
4256 hits. He may be a gambler, but he didn't cheat as a player. Didn't happen. Should he be banned from managing? Yes. Should he be banned from any employment in MLB? Yes.
But he belongs in the HOF.
|
|
|
Post by drock2006 on Mar 15, 2007 21:44:13 GMT -5
When he's dead and buried and he can't make a dime off it, they can put him in the hall.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 16, 2007 6:14:41 GMT -5
He didn't commit murder on TV. He didn't cheat his way into the record book like Bonds or McGwire. And as a player, his accomplishments deserve HOF status. He makes money off his name anyway. He wouldn't make more just because of a long overdue HOF election.
His biggest desire is to manage again. He shouldn't be allowed to do that. But he should be in the HOF.
|
|
|
Post by IronHorse4 on Mar 16, 2007 7:00:30 GMT -5
He very likely tainted the outcome of games, much like Barry Bonds very likely tainted games with his actions. Actually, Rose was worse in that respect, because he had direct control over games.
And again, a compulsive gambler who is in serious debt who has an opportunity to control a result HAD to have done it at least once, if not more. Just like Barry Bonds HAD to have taken growth hormone.
Rose affected Major League Baseball games. No one should be honored after doing that.
You want Bonds out? Rose is out, too.
|
|
$heriff Tom
Administrator
Groom ba ya ya ya
Posts: 16,173
|
Post by $heriff Tom on Mar 16, 2007 7:58:41 GMT -5
We've gone over this before. There is ONE sign in major league clubhouses warning you not to do anything. It does not say do not do drugs, it does not say do not fraternize or bang ugly groupies, it does not say do not cork bats.
It says NO WAGERING.
Pete Rose openly broke the one rule he was told not to break. He's out, and he'll stay out.
"I'm the best ambassador baseball has" -- Pete Rose
Yeah, I think Yogi Berra, Bob Feller, Hank Aaron, Willie Mays, Sandy Koufax, and a host of others might have something to say about that.
Sorry, but Pete Rose is a better ambassador than those guys. I dont think you understand his point here. Pete Rose is out and about, and despite the gambling still very much appreciated, and even liked, but a large segment of the baseball fandom. To bring up Sandy Koufax is dumb, he is a noted recluse. How is he an "ambassador?" By standing there behind a fence during Dodger spring training, refusing to acknowledge timid fans or even young players he does not recognize?
Pete Rose's point is he is out there trying to talk up the game. Cant argue that.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 16, 2007 8:45:28 GMT -5
He did not wager as a player. That has NEVER been even alleged. He did this when he was retired.
Yes, he did this as manager of the Reds. Had he been a 20 year manager with several championships under his belt, and going to be a sure HOFer manager, then I'd agree. No HOF.
Had he done what Joe Jackson did, I'd agree.
But as a player, Rose did not do anything worth baseball banishment. The HOF vote is based on what he did as a player.
The punishment here is not fitting the crime. Had he been in the HOF already, he would NOT have been tossed out. The reason he is not in the HOF is not due to the wagering. It's due to the fact that he got caught before the 5 year period was over.
Pete Rose should never be allowed to be a coach, manager or front office employee. But he belongs in the HOF. 4256 hits. It starts and ends there. It doesn't matter if he skull fucked Ty Cobb. He belongs in the HOF.
|
|
|
Post by IronHorse4 on Mar 16, 2007 8:48:22 GMT -5
He broke pretty much the only rule in baseball. And if he was in the Hall of Fame before it was all found out, he should be thrown out.
Hell, Barry Bonds deserves to be in the Hall of Fame before Pete Rose does. At least Barry didn't fix games.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 16, 2007 8:54:14 GMT -5
Barry Bonds cheated to get in the record book, as a player.
He doesn't belong in the HOF at all. Well, maybe the drug wing.
I don't care if he didn't cheat in the first half of his career. The second the needle hit his arm (or ass), all his stats should be void.
He shouldn't be in the HOF and the best part is that his legacy is as tainted as his piss. Selig has no balls, so he'll be in the record book, but anyone who follows the game will know it's malarky.
But Rose did not break that only rule as a player.
|
|
$heriff Tom
Administrator
Groom ba ya ya ya
Posts: 16,173
|
Post by $heriff Tom on Mar 16, 2007 9:06:30 GMT -5
Barry Bonds cheated to get in the record book, as a player
Has this alleged act been proven?
Last I checked, he has not been punished for anything, and will be out there on Opening Day. Whats this cheating you speak of?
Seems to me Pete Rose admitted to breaking the one rule that will get you kicked out of baseball, and the Hall. Barry Bonds has not been charged with anything.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 16, 2007 9:15:35 GMT -5
Anyone who with vision can see Bonds cheated.
Nevermind, he magically is the only human in history to get better in his late 30s. Miracles happen.
Jawlines change on their own. Shoe sizes increase.
Barry Bonds hasn't been charged with anything because Bud Selig is a pussy.
That's like saying OJ didn't do it because a dumb jury let him off.
|
|
|
Post by grover on Mar 16, 2007 11:24:06 GMT -5
That's a good way about doing it.
I hope I never stumble upon a dead body, because if anyone is around me and sees me next to it, I'm guilty, because anyone with vision can see I did it, because I'm standing next to a dead body. Proof be dammed!
Rose should not be in the Hall, and he should never be in the hall. If we can all assume that bonds is taking roids, and we all do, then we can easily assume that Rose was betting on games even before he was a manager. As a matter of fact, I say it's almost stupid to think that he wasn't, especially from us, who've sat next to numerous gamblers in the bleachers. We know what it's like from people we know, and the people we know are small potatoes compared to what Rose was doing. It's not like as soon as he was done playing he went "Hey what's this? Better? How's it work? What's a spread?" and then get hooked.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 16, 2007 12:23:20 GMT -5
If you're around the dead body, with a smoking gun in your hand, covered in the victim's blood, and an evil grin, with witnesses who saw you doing it, and the guy who sold you the gun saying just that, odds are you're guilty.
We can't assume that Rose was betting on games as a player. It's never even been alleged.
And after all this time, if they had any evidence of that, it would have come out.
Rose and Bonds are not at all related. Bonds cheated as a player. His entire career is a sham. Rose's troubles have nothing to do with his playing days.
4256 hits. It starts and ends there.
|
|
|
Post by IronHorse4 on Mar 16, 2007 12:55:21 GMT -5
Actually, it ends with the gambling, unfortunately. If he had the good sense to get out of the game before he started gambling, he wouldn't have violated any rules.
But he did, so.....that's where it ends.
Compulsive gamblers who have debt try to win any way they can. No doubt in my mind he is lying about the betting with regards to betting only on the Reds.
The parallels between Barry Bonds and Pete Rose are striking. They aren't the same to you, because I caught you in another of your famous hypocrisies. One guy cheats (under penalty of suspension), and his penalty should be multiplied tenfold. Another guy cheats (under penalty of banishment) and his penalty should be cut in half. Just want to make sure I have that clear.
Pete Rose is a disgrace to sport.
And Balls is a hypocrite. It starts and ends there.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Mar 16, 2007 13:06:55 GMT -5
It's nothing hypocritical, and I don't need name calling to make my side of the argument look better.
He did not gamble as a player. There are no parallels between Rose and Bonds. Two completely different situations.
Bonds' cheating directly impacted his place on the individual record books. His stats would not be what they are without it. We don't even know if he WOULD be a HOFer without it because we have no idea when he started cheating. But the bottom line is, he sure isn't one of the top HR hitters ever without his drugs.
Rose's actions WERE disgraceful. No one is denying that.
Both Rose and Bonds disgraced the game with their actions, but their actions affected the game in different ways. The punishments should not be the same.
Not putting Rose in the HOF is like not letting Bonds manage because he used steroids. It's not fitting.
It's not a hypocrisy because it is a CLEAR distinction.
Rose legitimately got 4256 hits and is a no brainer HOFer for his playing days. He disgraced the sport as a MANAGER and deservedly should never manage again.
Bonds did NOT legitimately position himself to break the all time HR record. All of his numbers are phony. He does not belong in the HOF because he did not cleanly put up HOF numbers as a player.
Hypocrisy would only exist if two identical situations were treated differently. If I were advocating McGwire getting in but not Bonds, then you'd be right, it would be hypocritical.
But that's not the case here. Rose and Bonds hurt the game in completely different ways. The punishments needs to match the crime.
|
|
|
Post by grover on Mar 16, 2007 13:13:32 GMT -5
There is no solid evidence for Rose betting while playing, yet we can assume that he did bet while playing, because he was a player/manager for a brief period, and chances are he was better way before that. Better likes that don't pop up overnight.
And if we can assume Bonds was on illegal substances before any solid evidence came out, which is what everyone did, why can we do it with Rose, who had more evidence piled on him since he's been banished from the sport for God knows for betting on the game?
Besides, the old "I bet on the Reds because I believed in them" sounds like a crock to cover up some of the bigger picture, or to make himself seem more valiant than he is, as if he's such a good sport where he loved he team so much and blah blah blah.
Banned for life. Keep it that way.
|
|