MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 14, 2010 10:05:58 GMT -5
My guess is that this thread will get little play. I'm not a soccer fan at all, and I don't know if Tom gives a crap about this either.
But I tried. I tried to watch the US/UK game.
I was determined to watch the whole thing, with an open mind, and to try to see what the hype is about.
I didn't like it.
I watched 90 minutes of guys kicking a ball around, back and forth. Are their skills awesome? Absolutely. Just to be able to run around for that long is amazing. The fact that these guys can control the ball the way they do--outstanding. The fact that they can take a ball kicked that hard and even head it, is amazing.
Is it a wimpy sport? Hell no. I get that.
I know that I could never do it.
The American goalie made some sick saves too. The English goalie fucked up.
But while I got that, I was thoroughly bored. I had trouble staying awake, and I had 9 hours sleep heading into that.
I get the kind of work these players have to go through to play 90 plus minutes of soccer.
The worst part? The game ended in a tie. All that time, all that hype, all that energy, and it was a god damn tie.
And people are acting like it was a good thing. A TIE. No one even won the game.
It's hard to accept a sport where a tie is so easy to have. No scoring. No overtime. No sudden death. None of that.
If the US plays at a time when I can watch, I'll give it another try. But honestly--I don't get it.
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Post by heartybooooo on Jun 14, 2010 10:26:00 GMT -5
I love soccer. I probably watch more soccer than any other sport (baseball is close). Work is getting in the way of watching as much of the World Cup as I would like. The US-England match was great. I was pumped watching it.
And besides the great action, athletic play, and all the spectacle, I love that there are no commercials. I have troubles watching sports because every 10 seconds there is a commercial.
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$heriff Tom
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Post by $heriff Tom on Jun 14, 2010 10:49:56 GMT -5
I woke up extra early Saturday, some idiot landscapers were up and at em by 7:45. While checking my phone, I noticed there were tweets on the game going on right then. So i got up and watched it. I also watched the US / England game.
Dont mind soccer. Tried to get into it even more, but who has the time. I do understand some of the detractors. Most wont even give it a chance though. My one main complaint of these games was not the play, it was those damned horns, and the beehive sound. I think Im going to watch future games with the sound down and music on, even though a guy like me could use help from the announcers following along in some regards.
Agree with Chris on the commercial-free aspect of it.
I saw a ton of posts this weekend of people who watched a whole game and saw 3-5 shots on goal, and no goals. I can see where this frustrates some people. Sometimes even I raise an eyebrow at the lack of offense sometimes. But I get it for what it is, and especially this around this time, I very much enjoy it. Great goal in that US / England game! One of the all-time sporting flubs.
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Post by yanksgooner on Jun 14, 2010 11:04:12 GMT -5
WAHhhhhhh! IT ENDED IN A TIE...wahhhh!!
Anyone who's seen the simpsons soccer episode can come up with that criticism of the game.
i'd rather watch a sport where fat-asses stand around on a field and run 5 yards every 35 seconds and then call a time out every 4th play.
Balls...a DRAW, not 'tie'....is a vital part of the overall standings and point totals. The fact that 2 juggernauts walked away with a point a piece and not 3 points and 0 points respectively makes the whole thing more interesting.
The minnow now leads the group with 3 points while the favorites have their work cut out for them tied for second place. What's so 'boring' about that?
I know, it's not the instant gratification American sports fans require for a 'winner'. You should probably stick to following men humping each other in tights for fake belts. At least there's a 'winner' in fake sports.
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 14, 2010 12:43:35 GMT -5
What is the difference between a draw and a tie?
Is that just the way they call it in soccer?
Either way, no one won. With all that work, no one won. I don't think it makes it more interesting that they played to a draw at all. I want a winner.
At least in football, there IS excitement. People score for one thing.
These fake sports are more interesting, and so are the real ones that have winners.
Again, I'm not saying there isn't major athleticism in soccer. The cardio alone is up there among the toughest sports. Basketball may be the only sport that competes with soccer cardio. I just felt that there was virtually no reward for all that effort.
I was very impressed with the American goalie. To be able to stop the shots he did was amazing. But that shouldn't be the big highlight.
Soccer is one of the toughest sports to play, but I was bored watching it.
I do agree with Chris on a bunch of things--the lack of commercials adds to the sport. They play for 45 minutes straight and even add to the clock when there is a stoppage for injury. That's one of the more interesting things about it.
I think Tom hits a flaw when he talks about how not only is there a great lack of goals, but there aren't even that many SHOTS on goal. And yeah, that beehive sound was really annoying.
I'm at least trying to get it. Maybe one game isn't enough. I'll try again if the scheduling is right.
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Post by yanksgooner on Jun 14, 2010 13:43:42 GMT -5
Your thinking is very 2-dimensional, as usual.
It just adds more variables into the overall scoring in leagues instead of WIN/LOSS.
Here, I'll put it in layman's terms for you:
Say, I dunno.. you're on a douchebag coed dodgeball team and you're even on points with another team in the league to the end of the season. They lose their last game and gain no points. It's up to you to go ahead. You're losing through 80 minutes of play with 10 to go. You then level and get the hard earned DRAW to win the league and get a pizza party courtesy of Zoink Sports or whatever league it is...
Is a draw still boring?
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 14, 2010 13:55:14 GMT -5
We don't have draws in dodgeball because they are lame. I realize your little need to put things in as obnoxious a form as you can, but that still doesn't change that not only was the game boring, but so was the result.
If ties weren't an option, then someone has to either win or lose. That's a lot more exciting than coasting for a tie. The idea of playing for a tie is ridiculous to me.
I'll try to put it in layman's terms for you:
Winner takes the league championship. Loser goes home.
Which is more exciting?
Ties are for 10 year olds that don't want to cry.
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Post by heartybooooo on Jun 14, 2010 13:55:18 GMT -5
Way to try to relate to the one who is learning.
I think instead of pizza, the winning team should get Doritos.
And I really like the US kits.
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Post by yanksgooner on Jun 14, 2010 14:11:05 GMT -5
Lame because it's more complicated...I see.
How can you say that game was boring? The entire country watched that game on the edge of their seats. Would you rather have the US go to extra time and lose? Or.. take the hard-earned draw into the next game having pipped the biggest threat in the group.
I realize there is not much I can do shed light on your views. Perhaps you're better off sticking to the ultimate rush that is co-ed dodgeball and letting the 10 year olds continue to play the world's obsession, fighting for draws.
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 14, 2010 14:15:08 GMT -5
It's not more complicated at all. It's just lame. Anyone can understand a tie is worth a point.
But being satisfied with a tie doesn't make sense. In the end, you're right back to wear you started.
How was that game exciting when there weren't even that many shots on goal. The excitement came when the US goalie stopped some big shots.
But that was a small part of the game. There was absolutely nothing that put me on the edge of my seat. Yes, the game is popular, and yes, there is a LOT of skill involved (far more than dodgeball), but that doesn't make a game where people just kick a ball back and forth EXCITING.
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Post by yanksgooner on Jun 14, 2010 14:25:13 GMT -5
OK...your only argument is to call is 'lame.'
If you can't understand the value of potentially losing a game and fighting back, capitalizing on a single mistake by your opponent to at least salvage a point, the discussion is lost.
Mind you...This is all coming from a huge BASEBALL fan which I find amusing. A game of long, drawn out 4 hour games, with countless lull's in the 'action'.
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Post by IronHorse4 on Jun 14, 2010 15:05:55 GMT -5
Balls isn't a baseball fan. He's a Yankee fan. There's a difference.
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Post by heartybooooo on Jun 14, 2010 15:56:27 GMT -5
I never understood calling soccer boring, particularly when done by baseball (or even Yankee fans). Constant action and motion. An athletic chess match. One mistake can doom you (or ultimate ectasy). Not unlike a pitching duel. Without all the breaks. And commercials (if you are watching at home with a bag of Doritos Collisions).
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Post by cactusjames on Jun 14, 2010 15:56:45 GMT -5
Italia!!!!!
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Post by heartybooooo on Jun 14, 2010 15:59:59 GMT -5
A lucky draw.
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Post by cactusjames on Jun 14, 2010 17:23:16 GMT -5
You can say luck, but it's either down 3 points or tied one a piece. And with the group they're in, if they didn't get the point they'd be screwed so I call it clutch. Plus the Paraguay goalie fucked up so sucks for them, they gave the defending World Champs too many chances and let him walk out with a point. It might have been lucky, but Paraguay is also lucky some of those chances at the end didn't go in or The Old Country would have 3 points right now.
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 15, 2010 8:23:01 GMT -5
But your only argument is to try to insult other forms of recreation. Yes, a tie is lame to me.
There's a lot about soccer that I definitely am willing to concede. I've said it before, but the sheer cardio alone is impressive.
If I haven't said it before, I'll say it now--these guys are very tough too. Any foot that can kick a ball as these guys can has a ton of power behind it, and these guys sometimes get kicked really hard and continue playing. The US goalie took a horrible kick to the ribs and kept playing well. I can only imagine the kind of pain he was in the next day, and even now.
There are a lot of lulls in baseball, no doubt. But at least there's always a winner. A tie in baseball is freakish and they don't count them in the standing. I get how a tie in soccer is better than losing. Of course I get that. But what I don't like is the idea that it's even a possible outcome. A game like that deserves a winner.
I can even see how from a player's perspective, it's never dull. But it was VERY hard to watch, as someone who isn't a soccer fan at all.
The athletic chess match is a good analogy, but I wouldn't want to watch chess either.
I hope the US has another game that I am able to watch. Not sure the rest of the schedule. I'd like to try again, but I don't think I can sit through a game where I don't even have a team to root for.
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Post by grover on Jun 15, 2010 12:13:59 GMT -5
Football ends in a draw. This is a tie.
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 15, 2010 12:16:53 GMT -5
So is this:
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Post by grover on Jun 15, 2010 12:18:04 GMT -5
Also, you really need to go to a bar to watch these games, with some fans of their respective teams.
I got stuck at Forum helping out Saturday because it was WALL TO WALL. No joke. They had to turn people away from the door. Was it a Johnny-Come-Lately crowd? I'm sure, but that's not what you should worry about, sitting in Yankee Stadium and all. It still made for a nice atmosphere. The atmosphere of the fans is more vital to Football than any of the 4 major American sports.
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 15, 2010 12:26:58 GMT -5
Maybe that's part of it. I wanted to watch at home in part because I wanted to hear announcers and hoped that I could learn while watching.
I guess a bar would help if the crowd was good. But still, it was a really tough sport to watch.
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Post by grover on Jun 15, 2010 13:09:07 GMT -5
Keith brings up a valid point:
You're a Yankee fan, which in turn means you watch Baseball. Take the beauty of a long at bat in a big spot, for instance. There's so much going on there that most don't see, but if you do, it's brilliant
Same for football. Once you know what's what, you appreciate the little things that go into it to make it dramatic, which is a lot more than most sports.
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 15, 2010 13:53:07 GMT -5
I get that too, and Chris' analogy about it being a chess match means something. One difference in baseball is that ultimately, there is a winner and loser in every confrontation. The batter will beat the pitcher, or the pitcher will beat the batter. A team HAS to win every game (with extremely rare exceptions).
I can see a casual baseball fan, or a newbie not getting things like working a pitch count, and may not get why something like Paul O'Neill's at bat against Armando Benitez was so big. And I will take your word that there are similar things in soccer.
I also do appreciate the art of defense. Defense is important in every sport. But for me, and I don't think I'm alone, the sheer difficulty of scoring a goal in soccer is a turn off. You don't need to score like basketball to have interest, but when 2 goals scored is considered a lot, and there aren't even that many ATTEMPTS to score, it's going to add to the boredom.
Baseball doesn't have a ton of scoring, but compared to soccer, it does.
It would be an interesting poll to see if people enjoy pitcher's duels v. slugfests. Both can be fun to watch. But if the game was ALWAYS pitcher's duels, and every year was like 1968, people would have more problems with baseball. Defense wins games, but offense is more entertaining. I think that's why they lowered the mound after 1968.
And draws absolutely are going to bother me. Not having a winner is also a reason I can't watch hockey.
I have no clue about the rules of the World Cup, but if it's like other sports that allow draws, I would think that you can't have a draw in the championship. What's the tie breaker? And if that's the rule in the championship, why not have that rule throughout?
I get how playing to a draw is better than a loss. I also get how when a lower seeded team does that, it's awesome for that team. But imagine the same excitement if that lower seeded team pulls off the true upset?
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Post by cactusjames on Jun 15, 2010 15:29:25 GMT -5
Hockey has the shootout now, so there is always a winner and a loser. Way to pay attention to the sports world outside of baseball. I don't understand trying to compare one thing to another when you don't know about either sport.
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 15, 2010 21:37:06 GMT -5
Sounds like the NHL recognized a major flaw in their sport, and did something about it.
One of the reasons I never got into hockey was the ties. You think I'd give a shit enough to follow rule changes?
But even so, unless I read it wrong, doesn't the NHL reward teams for losing in OT?
A loss is a loss.
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Post by yanksgooner on Jun 16, 2010 7:28:59 GMT -5
I'm afraid these ridiculous plastic horns are going to keep rearing their ugly heads for years to come, same as the scourge of professional baseball, the THUNDERSTICK. The damage is done.
What happened to good old fashioned SINGING at football?? What's more impressive than 25,000+ countrymen in voice getting behind their team? Instead they're hawking these 'vuvuzela horns' at the big stage which not only drone out real crowd noise, it's just impossible to decipher which fans are which and who is louder. Gay.
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$heriff Tom
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Post by $heriff Tom on Jun 16, 2010 7:58:08 GMT -5
Gooner, I mentioned, those horns nearly drove me to turn down the volume and put on some tunes. And a guy like me, my interest and decent track record of watching football / soccer aside, could use the announcers help to follow some of the nuances.
I too miss the singing.
Any truth to the rumor that some vuvuzela horns are going to make an appearance at the Bleacher Creature Softball tilt?
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Post by MSBNYY on Jun 16, 2010 9:00:06 GMT -5
I thought the horns were a South African thing only. It's weird that they sound like a bee buzzing when there are thousands of them, but they sound much lower when you hear one or two of them.
Now that Tom mentions it, I can't imagine those horns NOT being at the bleacher tourney en masse.
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Post by yanksgooner on Jun 16, 2010 10:10:14 GMT -5
let the sarf africans claim those dumb 'horns' all they want. bottom line is they've been at soccer and other pro sports around the globe for years, just not em masse the way they are at this world cup and certainly not with the media attention they have now. Take all the money spent on those noisemakers this summer and do something good with it at least.
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$heriff Tom
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Post by $heriff Tom on Jun 16, 2010 10:21:08 GMT -5
I cant think of anything that sounds less appealing than going to a sporting event and spending my time there blowing on a horn. Id rather spend my time drinking from a horn.
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