MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 4, 2008 13:07:37 GMT -5
I understand that, but Mae Young is not in even the oldies' league. It just seems that they are desperate to add people to the HOF, and they are now scraping.
Mae Young wouldn't be the first weak entrant in the HOF. Hell, Pete ROSE is in the HOF. So is William Perry.
But after such a stupid choice with the Rock's kin, following it up with Mae Young is just weak. They need someone better.
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Post by grover on Mar 4, 2008 13:09:22 GMT -5
Wait, you think putting High chief Maivia and Rocky Johnson are stupid choices?
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 4, 2008 13:21:31 GMT -5
More Rocky Johnson than Maivia.
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Post by cactusjames on Mar 4, 2008 13:24:58 GMT -5
I like it, Mae has been around now doing stuff here and there, she did hell of a lot more back in the day. The fact guys of my generation know of her and what she's done, I think she's a deserving choice. My first thought was how weird will it be to not see Moolah next to her when she gets inducted? To me that's the only sad part, it's nice she's going in. I say put as many deserving choices in as possible before their dead. It'd be a bigger crime to keep Mae out untill her death. Balls stop lobbying for Owen, I love the guy too but please don't shit on people going in just cause you don't like Owen isn't in yet. The logistics of putting Mae in now makes much more sense than throwing Owen in now, you want them to rush Owen's thing and do it half assed?
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 4, 2008 13:38:26 GMT -5
I don't see how they would be rushing anything. Owen's been gone 9 years now. What are they waiting for? There are SEVERAL people less deserving in the HOF than Owen. Owen is more deserving of anyone in this year's class EXCEPT Flair.
So far.
And how do we know she won't be next to Moolah when she is inducted? Sorry I killed Moolah with my mind by the way.
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Post by sancho231 on Mar 4, 2008 13:46:36 GMT -5
malarky MAe young is a great choice for the hall of fame, check out theses tidbits form her OWW page
Mae Young was the female Gorgeous George in the 50s, complete with her own valet..
Mae Young and Moolah ran a wrestling school together before they made their comeback in 2000..
# Mae Young was Bubba Bombed off the RAW Stage through multiple tables by Bubba Ray Dudley! # ~~~Bubba didn't want to do the stunt at first, but Mae slapped him accross the face and told him to treat her like one of the guys!
She's bad ass!!
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MSBNYY
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 4, 2008 13:49:11 GMT -5
The best argument in favor of Mae Young was that whole Bubba Bomb incident.
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Post by grover on Mar 4, 2008 13:49:18 GMT -5
Owen will wait until Vince can get Brett to come and induct him. He'll get there, no worries.
Come on Mr. Business first, you know how these things work.
And I ask again based on your post a few posts back: You think putting High chief Maivia and Rocky Johnson are stupid choices?
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Post by cactusjames on Mar 4, 2008 13:50:29 GMT -5
yeah and Freddie Blassie says she could have beat the shit out of 95% of the men, she goes in.
And Balls, re read Toms post about the Bret thing, that has EVERYTHING to do with it, that's why it'd be a rush. He just went in last year, and without him signing off on it, Owen goes no where. It's been 9 years since he died, but it'd be a rush to throw in him a year after Bret, it shouldn't be so lumped together.
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Post by grover on Mar 4, 2008 13:55:44 GMT -5
Balls is just mad because he wants to watch the ceremony and see Duke the Dumpster induct the Goon.
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 4, 2008 13:57:54 GMT -5
Hey--they're throwing in the Rock's kinfolk together too.
They put Guererro, who was no Owen Hart, in there before his body was cold.
Owen, unlike pretty much every other wrestler, literally gave his life for the company. Not drugs, not steroids, not suicide. A stupid accident by an AWESOME worker. This is a glaring omission.
Regarding Johnson and Maivia being stupid choices--less so Maivia. They made a decent case for him. But Rocky Johnson is definitely someone I would consider a stupid choice. Like I said last week, he doesn't have the numbers.
The real question would be, if not for the Rock, would Rocky Johnson or Peter Maivia be in the HOF?
I don't think Rocky Johnson would have even been considered.
It makes no sense.
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Post by cactusjames on Mar 4, 2008 14:55:52 GMT -5
In my opinion, High Cheif without question. Johnson is iffy, but I'd still say yes only cause the first black guy to win the tag titles. To me, that's big enough to warrant induction, but I def agree Rock helps that out. And also, if they weren't to induct Johnson, and Rock still said yes regardless, he's going to go up there and talk for grandfather? It makes more sense to have them both go in this way two thirds of the lineage is represented.
And they may have done it right after Eddie died, but they weren't being sued by the Guererro's, Chavo was still employed and if I'm not mistaken, they had no plans for Vicki at the time so they did that as more of a bonus for her financially, hence appearing at both the HOF and WM. I may be wrong, they may have been planning for a while, but that'd be my guess as to giving Eddie the nod(who in my opinion is JUST as deserving as Owen, not more or less).
They weren't on good terms with Bret, they were being sued by Martha Hart, why would they induct him? They just settled this shit with Bret a year ago, the DVD and the Hall thing, it would be a rush to put Owen in now. Like you said, the circumstances in which he died makes him a special case. So why take away from his induction putting it right on top of his brother's induction? I'm willing to bet Owen gets a special memorial thing when he goes in, so doing both Bret and Owen back to back would lessen the novelty of Owen's. I mean you're going to complain about Eddie going right in and Naitch isn't even retired? And that's not a knock on Naitch, just to me you're grasping at straws to justify you're want of Owen to be in the day after he did a header on the top rope. Bret's a baby, he needss to have him moment in the sun, the talented Hart, the King of Harts will have his own day, I don't want Owen be over shadowed by his brother even in death.
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 4, 2008 15:25:50 GMT -5
I think the HOF is more significant today than 9 years ago.
It annoyed me that Guererro was rushed into the HOF and Owen is still not in, especially given that Guererro basically killed himself with his drug habits.
I won't complain about Flair. Wrestling isn't a sport. It doesn't matter if you're retired or not.
Owen should have gone in BEFORE Bret. But it's been a year since Bret's gone in. It wouldn't overshadow anything.
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Post by drock2006 on Mar 4, 2008 19:00:29 GMT -5
Guerrero was put in because Vince could makea buck off it. If benoit had not offed the family whille dying he'd be going in complete with DVD retrospective
Rocky Johnson is going in to get the Rock to show up and sell tickets and make an appearance. had the Rock said no thanks I doubt he would be going in
If it were about wrestling and not money Backlund would be in. The only reason Roberts is going in is so Vince can show how he , out of the goodness of his heart, offered Jake rehab and by golly look at him all cleaned up. Look at Vince helping his ex wrestlers unlike the NFL players. Vince cares!
If they want to do the right thing with Owen, do it in name, in private, without making a dime off it before they turn the cameras on or let the crowds in.
But that won't happen.
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 4, 2008 20:20:47 GMT -5
I'm sure Mr. Backlund will get his day eventually.
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Post by grover on Mar 4, 2008 20:48:44 GMT -5
Sorry, but I really don't think the WWE is making THAT much money off of this thing.
Yeah, some cash is made, but it's not like this is a make or break deal and if this didn't go on Wrestlemania wouldn't go on.
Really, who is going to put Owen in the Hall? Bret. And guess what? Aren't they STILL announcing names? And if they don't put Owen in this year, it will probably be because they don't want to take any thunder from Flair, who deserves the spotlight to himself, and not have Owen's induction muscle it's way in.
I mean, really, you guys are making a mountain out of a molehill, and speaking stupid. Rocky Johnson doesn't belong? He doesn't have the numbers? And what numbers are these? All the NWA titles he held?
Oh, I see. 'Doesn't have the numbers' = 'I never saw him wrestle because I started watching wrestling in 1989 and everything before that must have been boring and doesn't matter.'
I vote Balls for induction for the worst wrestling fan hall of fame. Hey Mr. I stopped watching TNA once Bob Backlund left: I remember tales from my bro as a kid telling me how he used to stay up late to watch Tony Atlas and Rocky Johnson and how they used to kick major ass in their day. I'm not the only one who thinks this, and that's obvious by him getting in.
He doesn't have the numbers. PFFT, stick to Baseball.
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 4, 2008 20:54:22 GMT -5
It's an expression. But Rocky Johnson doesn't belong. He had a relatively short run at the top in the WWE. A tag champ for less than a year.
Rocky Johnson is in for ONE reason--his son.
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Post by grover on Mar 4, 2008 21:15:52 GMT -5
This isn't limited to WWF/WWE work, you know. Some of the best wrestlers ever didn't have much work in the WWE, so the WWE shouldn't honor them?
You're taking this too seriously, which means you're going to make a stupid argument out of this.
So Rocky Johnson should not be in because his stint as champ was short? Well, then I guess based on that Roddy Piper and his brief stints as IC and Tag champs should have kept him out.
Rocky Johnson = WWE hall of fame
MSB = 'I Don't Watch Wrestling Hall of Fame' and 'I Became A Hogan Fan 20 Years After Everyone Else Hall of Fame'
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 5, 2008 6:46:14 GMT -5
You cannot POSSIBLY compare Rocky Johnson's impact to Roddy Piper's. That fact alone speaks volumes. Piper doesn't need a title.
Whether it's limited to the WWE or not, Rocky Johnson's career is not HOF worthy. He is not one of the most remembered or best of all time, even if your friend liked him when he was 5 years old.
And I'm not the one making a stupid argument out of this--you are. You seem to be taking it almost personally. But it still doesn't change that if not for his Rock producing sperm, Rocky Johnson would be long forgotten.
There are jobbers that accomplished more than Rocky Johnson, like SD Jones and Barry Horowitz. Rocky Johnson in the HOF? Even Tom laughed that one off.
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Post by grover on Mar 5, 2008 9:56:45 GMT -5
There goes the goofy pop culture alert! Dude the only reason you know who he is is that they showed pics of him and mentioned him as an old wrestler during Rock's career. Don't even try to pass off like you watched him back in the day. Tony Atlas is in, and Johnson will be in, and rightfully so. Rocky Johnson > Owen Hart Rocky Johnson = Hall of fame Owen Hart = Dead Maybe Owen Hart would be in the hall if he wasn't fucking stupid enough to jump off the rafters before they were done strapping him in. For that alone he should be kept out.
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 5, 2008 10:07:54 GMT -5
Uh oh! When in doubt, make a pop culture reference, even though that still doesn't change that Rocky Johnson doesn't belong in the HOF, even though you say so.
I never said he never wrestled. But he is hardly one of the best of all time. Yes he won a TAG strap. He was never a single champion, and pretty much ANY wrestler who was a WWF champion belongs there over Rocky Johnson.
He isn't even as important to wrestling history as the Honky Tonk Man.
If you are seriously thinking that Rocky Johnson would even be mentioned today if not for the fact that he sired the Rock, you are fooling yourself.
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Post by grover on Mar 5, 2008 10:21:08 GMT -5
Again, since when do you need a heavyweight title to be a lock? Piper disproves that.
You didn't watch Johnson and you can't figure out that putting Owen in with Flair will take from his induction and putting Owen in without Bret will have people talking more about Bret not being there than Owen being honored.
Stop fucking arguing to argue asshole. The fact that you said Johnson never won a strap when he was the NWA Florida, Mid-Atlantic, and Georgia Heavyweight champion during a time when the regions still mattered in wrestling, and during a time where black wrestlers didn't get much of a push at anything, shows you're really talking about things you don't know.
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 5, 2008 10:32:59 GMT -5
I never said you need a heavyweight title to be a lock.
Piper is in a class by himself. You can't possibly compare Rocky Johnson to Piper when Piper is possibly one of the top TEN wrestlers of all time.
And I'm not arguing to argue--you are. You may be the only one actually defending Rocky Johnson's induction as anything more than an attempt to get the Rock to make an appearance.
There is NO WAY the guy would be in the WWE HOF if not for his son. His biggest accomplishments have been dwarfed by so many others and he is absolutely nothing special.
Stop acting like he was Jackie Robinson. He wasn't even Tony Atlas.
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Post by grover on Mar 5, 2008 10:52:58 GMT -5
So? Atlas was another prime example of how held back black wrestlers were back then. He should have been a champion many times over. And the way you sound talking about Atlas you make it seem like he wasn't anything special either. Atlas was fantastic.
No, if it wasn't for the Rock YOU wouldn't know who he was. Rocky Johnson was plenty good, and he, along with Atlas, were the first black men to hold the WWE tag straps. Were both men white, with their skill and physique, they would have dominated. This is obvious because it took nearly another decade and a half before Ron Simmons got a short title run in WCW.
Sorry that you think Yokozuna and the Ultimate Warrior should go in, but you think Outback Jack and the Bodydonnas should go in, so your opinion in null and void. Sure there are better than Johnson, but that doesn't make Johnson undeserving, and those who are better will have their time. Can't fill the card with the best right away, you goof, because they want this to be an annual thing.
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Post by grover on Mar 5, 2008 10:55:08 GMT -5
Sorry double post.
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 5, 2008 10:57:30 GMT -5
Actually, I had heard of Rocky Johnson long before the Rock was a wrestler. When the Rock came up, he was "Rocky Johnson's son." Now, Rocky Johnson is "the Rock's father." Johnson was a "superstar," meaning that he was well above a jobber, but he was not a HOF level superstar.
Johnson is pretty much at the level of the Bodydonnas. Good example.
Rocky Johnson is NOT deserving. If not for his son, there is NO WAY he would be getting this honor.
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Post by grover on Mar 5, 2008 11:14:09 GMT -5
You call him a superstar and compare him to the Bodydonnas, who were never superstars.
That's convincing.
"When the Rock came up, he was "Rocky Johnson's son." Now, Rocky Johnson is "the Rock's father." Johnson was a "superstar," meaning that he was well above a jobber, but he was not a HOF level superstar. "
No, meaning that the Rock because one of the most popular wrestlers of our time. Seriously, is popularity over the last 30 years is only matched by Hogan and Austin. What do you think they are going to say? Wow, you're clueless.
LOL @ OWEN HART! The only 'Hart' Owen has was the one that stopped when his neck snapped against the turnbuckle.
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Post by $heriff Tom on Mar 5, 2008 11:51:58 GMT -5
Balls, you are an idiot.
FIRST - I explained this already. Hart was not going in these past "9 years" cause WWE was embroiled in LAWSUITS with his family during that time. They were also not on speaking terms with Bret. Now that all this seems resolved, he is back on the clock. Hey, for all we know Owen's immediate family, who has no love lost for the WWE (including a nasty book written about the fed and Owen aftermath from his former wife) asked the WWE to leave him alone. They may not need this dredged up, and quite frankly the WWE does not need to do it.
WWE makes no money on this stuff. There is a short boost of DVD sales. Balls, you are making WAY too much of this. Its just an excuse for a bunch of oldtimers to have a laugh, and enjoy the company of friends, and some attention for their efforts.
There is no one in the world who gives a crap about this, except you.
As to Backlund, the WWE is long on record as saying they would not induct him until he officially retired and stopped playing around with TNA, and as of a couple of months ago he was still saying he was not prepared to do that yet. He still thinks he can wrestle.
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Post by grover on Mar 5, 2008 12:00:21 GMT -5
Yeah, really. Balls, go look at the list of people in the WWE Hall of Fame. What money did the WWE make from putting the likes of Bobo Brazil, Ernie Ladd and James Dudley? This is the industry tipping it's cap to people within the industry, especially the old timers. People can watch if they like but if not the show would still go on.
Balls, this is what I mean when you argue for the sake of doing so. You ignore everyone details and reasoning and just sit stubbornly repeating your own short on info opinion.
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Post by MSBNYY on Mar 5, 2008 12:25:51 GMT -5
But again, Rocky Johnson isn't even in the leagues of THOSE guys. You are the one arguing for the sake of arguing. The only reason Rocky Johnson is getting this attention is to get his son to make an appearance. He would never get that tip of the cap otherwise.
And please find one quote from the WWE about Mr. Backlund. It shouldn't be too hard, since it's long been on record.
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