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Post by grover on Oct 11, 2007 18:35:45 GMT -5
Gracie would still wipe the floor with 90% of that weight class. And Randy is the defending champ. Word is out of his camp that the UFC heads flat out lied to him about him being the 2nd highest paid guy.
So, in his eyes, since Fedor is ducking the real competition, and since he is being malarkyted, he's walking away. Why get lowballed to fight bums at his age? He wanted Fedor, and was going to ride into the sunset. That's not happening, so there's no reason to put up with any sort of malarky.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 11, 2007 18:40:03 GMT -5
It would be interesting to see Gracie fight full time. Hughes kicked the living shit out of him in his comeback.
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Post by grover on Oct 12, 2007 0:14:32 GMT -5
The Gracies were always a bit overrated, yet at the same time, they could kick most fighters asses off.
That is until UFC/Pride rules changed. One they lost their advantages, they were beatable. Still, most of the people who beat Graceis are also people who are in "Greatest of all time" discussions, such as Hughes, Sakuraba, & Silva.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 6:16:32 GMT -5
I wonder how it would go if Hughes fought Gracie again--under the rules of the original UFC when basically you could do anything except fishhook and eye gouge. No weight classes. One round--until there's a winner.
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Post by $heriff Tom on Oct 12, 2007 7:21:52 GMT -5
Royce Gracie has thrown his lot in with Bodog Fight. And he has nothing to gain by fighting again, and potentially getting his clock rocked.
I've given up on Mixed Martial Arts and Ultimate Fighting altogether. I had been watching Bodog weekly, but just dont have the time. Too hooked on my classic wrestling. Bodog is losing its weekly TV anyway. So you guys have fun in here. Balls, dont fall asleep during the press conference announcing Couture quitting. I know you have trouble keeping awake during big UFC moments.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 7:30:04 GMT -5
I have a Tempurpedic mattress. Couldn't help it.
I haven't watched Bodog. Most of my UFC watching is the reality show. It's a great way to get into that sport.
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Post by grover on Oct 12, 2007 9:50:11 GMT -5
Do you watch Fight Night?
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 9:52:12 GMT -5
On occasion, but not too often. It's not a show I'd sit down and spend an hour or two on, but it's one that I might watch briefly. Fight Night is good because you get to see more of the top guys doing their thing.
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Post by grover on Oct 12, 2007 10:52:22 GMT -5
LOL If you're getting into the sport why not watch the show that shows the most fights? That's like a person getting into Baseball but only watching Baseball Tonight.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 11:23:52 GMT -5
That's a funny analogy. I don't know if it's 100 percent accurate, but still kind of funny.
I guess I need more than just the fights for the entertainment. I really like the reality show a lot.
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Post by cactusjames on Oct 12, 2007 11:41:30 GMT -5
I'm opposite, give me two guys beating the shit out of each other for 10 15 minutes and that's all I need. I like the commercial I just saw promoting the next three ppvs for one price, I'm going to take it. Any discount I can get on ordering TNA or UFC ppvs is a bonus considering all the WWE ppvs I buy per year.
And in my opinion, Gracie gets his ass kicked by mostly everyone in UFC now.
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Post by grover on Oct 12, 2007 11:47:04 GMT -5
I don't think so. Hughes got him good, but aside from Hughes and GSP, Gracie would wipe the floor with everyone else.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 12:09:38 GMT -5
I think at this point, that's one of those things I'd have to see to believe--especially at Gracie's age.
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Post by grover on Oct 12, 2007 12:31:05 GMT -5
It's not that far of a stretch. Who else is there in that division besides Hughes and GSP? Anyone else good, which is a small figure, would probably get beat.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 12:52:35 GMT -5
It's amazing how little respect Serra still gets--not just from you. He really needs to beat Hughes.
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Post by cactusjames on Oct 12, 2007 13:07:44 GMT -5
Look how bad Shamrock got his ass beat he tried making a comeback. Guys from then are lucky to win at this point where UFC is. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying it's far fetched he would beat someone, Gracie could win some fights, I just think going by Balls scenario of no divisions, anyone can fight anyone, who besides people in that weight class would lose to him? Guys like Rampage would kill him. Granted, I havn't seen tons of Gracie's fights, I just think some of those older guys would have a real hard time hanging with todays guys.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 13:33:33 GMT -5
You should check out the early UFCs. The sport changed so much since then.
It's much more regulated and much more like boxing today. More rules.
They actually have some cool stuff on Youtube, like this one fight between some 650 pound (Literally) guy v. some 250 pound guy. The big guy threw the little guy out of the octagon at first. As in he shoved him, and the guy went through the door.
Then the little guy got back in the cage and KOed the big guy. If I remembered the names, I could probably find that fight on Youtube.
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Post by cactusjames on Oct 12, 2007 13:55:36 GMT -5
I've seen old UFC, all I said was I hasn't seen much Gracie.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 14:11:43 GMT -5
Gotcha. Type in Royce Gracie on Youtube, and I bet you find a lot of his fights--including nonUFC stuff.
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Post by grover on Oct 12, 2007 14:27:13 GMT -5
It's amazing how little respect Serra still gets--not just from you. He really needs to beat Hughes. There's good reason for that. The only reason you're away of Serra is because he's been on the Ultimate Fighter twice, once as someone who was washed up trying to make it back. By even trying to pass of Serra in Gracie's class is being ridiculous. If Serra beats Hughes I will be amazed, more amazed than when he beat GSP, and that shocked the hell out of EVERYONE. And Shamrock was ALWAYS overrated. Sure he got a good win here and there, but other than that for the last decade he's been steadily getting his ass beat by Frye, Ortiz, Franklin.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 14:30:32 GMT -5
You're right about that. Serra's fame and prominence came from the reality show. But he did score a HELL of a win over GSP. He's a phenomenal teacher, though I admit it was like a Rocky-style victory.
It sounds like winning the title alone isn't enough--he has to beat Hughes.
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Post by grover on Oct 12, 2007 14:34:58 GMT -5
And he has to continue to win after that.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 12, 2007 14:39:54 GMT -5
True, but a guy who holds victories over GSP and Matt Hughes should not be considered a bum.
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Post by grover on Oct 12, 2007 17:47:05 GMT -5
If he loses to a bum after that he will be considered a fluke.
If Hughes trains like he always did, he will kill Serra. Hughes took GSP lightly and GSP got him good, and GSP took Serra lightly and Serra got him good.
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Post by $heriff Tom on Oct 21, 2007 12:16:52 GMT -5
Surprised you yokes are not bandying this about...thanks to the Torch for this.
WWE News: Brock Lesnar declares organization he's signed with, UFC, a dream come true
By Wade Keller, Torch editor
Former WWE champion and headliner Brock Lesnar announced on UFC's PPV last night that he has signed with the UFC. Joe Rogan interviewed Lesnar at ringside after the third fight, calling him "one of the most exciting acquisitions for UFC." He mispronounced his name at first, confused with Brock Larson, another MMA fighter.
Lesnar said, "I finally made the big-time, baby." Lesnar said with his amateur roots, he always loved this sport and he's so excited to now be part of it. He said he's "on the big battleship, USS UFC" and he's "ready for a fight." He said after 18 years as an amateur wrestler, he's trained two years in MMA exclusively.
Basic stuff without an acknowledgment of his previous MMA fight or a sense of when he'd debut or whom it might be against. It was a newsworthy moment, though, as many expect Lesnar to be a heavyweight title force in 2008.
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Post by cactusjames on Oct 21, 2007 15:33:46 GMT -5
If I'm not mistaken he lost his MMA fight, that's why they didn't mention him. They expect him to be a title contender, I don't know he can hack it in UFC. Fine, he's big and has a wrestling backround. You can have knockout power but if you can't connect you don't do damage, and most heavyweight guys are knockout fighters. We know he'll be able to defend himself on the ground, but I think standing up he's in trouble. Fuck, Angle whipped his ass in an inpromtu amateur scrap back when. He's going to get smoked in the octagon.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 21, 2007 16:35:40 GMT -5
I've only seen Lesnar in one MMA fight. It's on Youtube, and he destroyed the guy in less than a round.
He's one of those guys that has huge potential but you just don't know. I'm sure his fame will be frowned upon by other fighters, and they will be gunning for him.
The stand up game is something that probably depends on how well he's trained. He's probably a great natural athlete, so it remains to be seen how he'll take to it.
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Post by grover on Oct 21, 2007 20:05:25 GMT -5
He could do very well due to his amateur wrestling background. Then again, he could have no chin. We'll see I guess.
MMA is why you're probably never going to see any amateur wrestlers becoming pro wrestlers anymore. The only ones who will go are the ones who can't hack MMA.
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Post by MSBNYY on Oct 21, 2007 22:03:09 GMT -5
I don't know about that. But it's an interesting question. You get more fame in the WWE at this point. Much larger audience, much bigger arenas, and I would think much more money.
That's probably a good attraction for an amateur wrestler--especially with what Angle and Lesnar accomplished, among others.
As for Lesnar, you hit it right on the head. The amateur wrestling is why he has a good shot. This isn't exactly HHH or HBK going into the WWE. Lesnar is one of the few that has a shot.
It would be damn funny if he has a glass jaw though.
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Post by grover on Oct 21, 2007 23:12:04 GMT -5
From what I've read of the guys floating around in feds like OVW is that the number of amateur wrestlers going to wrestling decreased at an alarming level, to the point where they are saying it will soon be a rarity that you see an amateur wrestler at a wrestling school. Jut because you wrestle doesn't mean you like WWE/TNA wrestling, and the transition to MMA is much easier.
You really have to be top of your game in the WWE to make the big time cash. Guys like Paul London and such don't make the $800k you see Batista getting. They get around $100-150-200 k range.
I remember reading that Diego Sanchez got 32 k for one man event victory. I imagine that the higher up guys were getting more, and don't forget when Pride was around they were handing out cash too. New promotions will soon be popping up, so the pay will only go up once investors with tons of cash see that there is money to be made of this.
So to some, the pay in the WWE looks nice, but the fact that you're on the road about 250 days a year, wrecking your body, not having a normal life isn't that attractive to everyone.
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