MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Nov 3, 2006 8:54:57 GMT -5
Might as well kick off this thread since I didn't see another one. The Yanks have some decent pitching prospects on the horizon. Philip Hughes is obviously the main event guy right now, barring injury, but there are a few others.
Might as well use this thread to discuss the future. For all the shit the Yanks have taken, they have done a nice job of replenishing the system. While it is hardly the best in the majors, and there are teams with better, our farm system has made nice improvements and is heading in the right direction.
Other prospects I'm following:
1. Jose Tabata-- Just 18 years old, he played low A ball last year and batted around .300. Solid player, and to accomplish what he did at his age is impressive. I look forward to seeing how he does in high A next year. Who knows? We may even see him in AA. He didn't play after the beginning of August though. I have no idea why he was shut down.
2. Tyler Clippard. A lot of people are talking about him because he dominated AA ball in the second half of last season. He had a shit first half, but a second half that rivaled Hughes. It gets him some decent buzz. I figure he'll be in AAA next season.
3. Steven White. I watched him all of last year because I think I saw some article that listed him as one of the top pitching prospects. He was a little ahead of Hughes in the development as of last year. He started last season in AA ball and did extremely well. So well, that he was promoted to AAA at the end of last season. He didn't do THAT well there but he really didn't have that much time to adjust to the higher level. It's not a fair sample. Even Hughes struggled in his first 5 or so starts in AA. New level, better hitting, etc. White's a bit older though, at 25 years old. Tom told me he rates him higher than Clippard. I look forward to seeing how he does in Scranton this year.
Scranton is going to have a solid pitching staff next season, with Hughes, White and Clippard as the three rotation guys. If all goes right, Scranton will be winning ballgames because they will have solid pitching. More important, if all goes right, we may start seeing these guys crack the rotation in the big leagues.
Moose isn't signed yet. Wang is the ace. Randy Johnson and Carl Pavano are shit. Jaret Wright can go to hell. Cory Lidle is dead.
We also have Karstens and Rasner who are decent young arms and did fairly well for us this year and should get a look this spring.
There's a lot of uncertainty but also a lot of potential.
|
|
|
Post by 9 on Nov 3, 2006 11:50:53 GMT -5
I think a Scranton road trip is in order.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Nov 3, 2006 12:34:58 GMT -5
I would think J Brent Cox will also be heading to AAA this season as well. They keep talking about him as being one of the closest prospects to being ready for MLB. Seems like sticking him in AAA is the logical way to go.
And if he pitches in AAA like he did in AA, he might get a midseason call up. He's a middle reliever. Might as well give him a chance.
|
|
|
Post by 9 on Nov 3, 2006 13:15:56 GMT -5
Is he the guy we drafted instead of Hansen from St. John's, who went to Boston, or am I screwing up my years?
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Nov 3, 2006 13:26:19 GMT -5
That's the guy. Besides, it would be funny to have a pitching staff that has Wang, Cox, & Johnson. Nice article on Darrell Rasner at www.yankees.com.
|
|
|
Post by elliejay21 on Nov 7, 2006 2:43:28 GMT -5
I want to go on the road trip to Scranton!
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Nov 10, 2006 16:50:47 GMT -5
Ok, figure this is better in this thread. Here are the two Baseball America write ups on Melancon and Whelan. Both are top ten prospects for the Yanks and Tigers. Not sure if the trade we made today bumps anyone off the Yankee top ten list, but it may.
Let the debating begin:
MELANCON: Background: Arizona's single-season (11) and career (18) saves leader, Melancon projected as a first-round pick until a strained elbow ligament ended his junior season in April. Satisfied by the results of an MRI exam, New York snapped him up in the ninth round and signed him for $600,000. He had to leave Hawaii Winter Baseball after just four appearances with what initially was characterized as a sore arm.
Strengths: At his best, Melancon has power stuff that fits the closer profile. His fastball ranges from 92-95 mph with late life. He attacks hitters high and low, with enough giddy-up on his heater to work up in and out of the strike zone, and a hammer 12-to-6 curveball. Coaches rave about Melancon's work ethic and positive contribution to team chemistry.
Weaknesses: Melancon's maximum-effort delivery puts stress on his elbow, and his missed time has limited attempts to tone it down. He avoided surgery in the spring and his setback in Hawaii isn't believed to be serious, but his health is still a concern.
The Future: A healthy Melancon would be the Yankees' leading in-house candidate to eventually replace Mariano Rivera at the back of the bullpen. He'll probably begin 2007 in high Class A.
WHELAN:
Drafted: Texas A&M, 2005 (4th round) Signed by: Tim Grieve Background: Whelan took control of his career in the Jayhawk League in 2003, asking his coach to move from catcher to pitcher, but had to move back behind the plate at Texas A&M due to injuries to the Aggies’ other backstops. He exploded as a pitching prospect in the Cape Cod League in 2004 with a 0.42 ERA and a league-best 11 saves. He finally became a full-time pitcher in 2005, signed for $265,000 as a fourth-round pick and had a sterling pro debut.
Strengths: Whelan has classic closer stuff. His four-seam fastball tops out at 96 mph, and his two-seamer has wicked sink. When he widens his grip on the two-seamer, it morphs into a mid-80s splitter that buries hitters. His delivery has some deception as well, complicating matters for hitters even more. He’s a dogged competitor.
Weaknesses: Just 6 feet tall, Whelan has to make sure he maintains his over-the-top delivery to keep his fastball from flattening out. He generally succeeds. He continues to pick up pitching nuances as he gains experience on the mound.
The Future: Whelan hasn’t yet to pitch above low Class A, but few in the organization will be shocked if he reaches Detroit in a set-up role this year. With no defined closer in Detroit, he could step forward and seize the role by 2007.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 8:27:33 GMT -5
Very glowing reports coming out on both Hughes and Sanchez today. Granted, they were from Giambi, but still, it's good to see these comparisons. The papers are actually going as far as saying the Yankees screwed up last season by not bringing Hughes up for the playoff run.
Let's just hope Hughes and Sanchez both have the ice water in their veins necessary to succeed in the Bronx. Sanchez is throwing 96. Hughes is throwing 94.
I always forget--are pitchers ahead of hitters, or are hitters ahead of pitchers at the start of spring training? Obviously, Giambi not seeing live pitching in a long time could factor into things, but it sure beats a lousy report.
|
|
$heriff Tom
Administrator
Groom ba ya ya ya
Posts: 16,173
|
Post by $heriff Tom on Feb 23, 2007 13:04:28 GMT -5
Pitchers are WAY ahead of hitters in spring training.
Also, anyone who thinks the Yankees made a mistake not bringing up Hughes last year is a full-fledged moron. The Yankees "shut him down" after his innings max cause of all his chintzy arm troubles. And the wrong time to bring in a touted kid is in the pressure of a playoff push, especially when the Yankees were more than capable of getting there without him.
I dont read much into reports coming out of Yankee camp, from Yankees especially. The same things were said about Ambirox Burgos in Mets camp by David Wright yesterday, for example.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 13:20:09 GMT -5
I think last year, it was super caution that limited Hughes' innings. The injuries were the year before, not last year. They basically decided on a 150 inning limit and that was that.
This year that limit will be pushed to 175-180 innings. So I guess he'll be working 200 innings by 2008.
If they seriously consider him part of the plan for 2007, then his starts will have to be limited in the early part of the season if they want to keep that inning limitation.
This just feels too good to be true. DEVELOPING a real ace?
Something is going to go wrong.
|
|
$heriff Tom
Administrator
Groom ba ya ya ya
Posts: 16,173
|
Post by $heriff Tom on Feb 23, 2007 13:26:57 GMT -5
To me, things are already going wrong. Limiting his innings already is wrong. He is the only top prospect I know of that is pitching to that kind of slate. It tells me there are legit concerns about his arm. Believe what you want, but thats my call.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 13:29:32 GMT -5
Too many young aces have thrown out their arms in recent years. I understand your point, but I don't mind the cautious approach, given his age.
|
|
|
Post by 9 on Feb 23, 2007 14:09:24 GMT -5
I agree with the cautious approach, but I think they're being a little overcautious. That said, I'd rather the Yankees do what they're doing than ruin his career, Tim Leary-style. But he's got to be stretched out at some point.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 14:17:22 GMT -5
He's not even 21 yet. This year 180 innings. He'll be throwing 200 innings by age 22 and likely all of them will be in the majors. That's fine.
|
|
|
Post by 9 on Feb 23, 2007 14:28:04 GMT -5
I'd like them to let him go longer in games. I'm obviously not saying I want to see him throw 150 pitches on a cold night in Scranton, but from what I read last year, he was getting pulled after the fifth inning in most of his starts, and I don't know if it was a low pitch count ordered by management, if he was running high pitch counts, or what the deal was.
|
|
$heriff Tom
Administrator
Groom ba ya ya ya
Posts: 16,173
|
Post by $heriff Tom on Feb 23, 2007 14:40:52 GMT -5
I don't know if it was a low pitch count ordered by management, if he was running high pitch counts, or what the deal was.
Its because, even at that early point in the season, he was "on pace to" exceed his prescribed limit, so they were pulling him after 5 innings or 75 pitches, whichever came first. Sorry, but its a ridiculous way to do business. There are no other top pitching prospects being coddled like that, and contrary to popular belief Hughes is NOT the only pitching prospect stud out there.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 14:46:55 GMT -5
Again, many top prospects have blown out their arms before turning 25. It's been 30 years since the Yankees developed someone like this, and I don't blame them for being overly cautious.
|
|
$heriff Tom
Administrator
Groom ba ya ya ya
Posts: 16,173
|
Post by $heriff Tom on Feb 23, 2007 14:50:03 GMT -5
Its stupid.
Watch him have a great spring, and then he will be expected to fill a major league slot....after averaging 5.1 innings per start last year! Let him get ready, let him air it out and go deep into games. We dont need a guy that cant remember the last time he saw the 7th inning. There is a difference between keeping an eye on your pitchers and BABYING them. The Yankees are literally being laughed at for the way they coddled him last year, and some scouts even wonder if he is hurt after all. And I agree, its a red flag to me.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 14:52:31 GMT -5
He won't be filling a MLB spot without some injuries going on. They WANT to start him in Scranton. 180 innings this year. 200 next year. He's only 21. I wonder who laughed at him, the Cubs? They have a GREAT record with young pitching.
Who cares if other teams laugh?
|
|
|
Post by Chris on Feb 23, 2007 14:53:10 GMT -5
Anyone heard anything on how this new Cuban kid Juan Miranda is panning out? Will he make the Yankees roster?
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 15:18:41 GMT -5
The guy's not even a top 10 prospect, so I doubt it. We only have one real potential position player right now with Tabata, and he's not ready yet.
|
|
$heriff Tom
Administrator
Groom ba ya ya ya
Posts: 16,173
|
Post by $heriff Tom on Feb 23, 2007 15:25:43 GMT -5
There are no immediate returns expected with Miranda. In fact, on the depth chart he ranks behind even Andy Phillips and Josh Phelps in terms of chance of making the team. He needs to go downstairs and start facing pitching on this side of the shores before he starts poking around the big show.
|
|
|
Post by Chris on Feb 23, 2007 15:55:47 GMT -5
Isn't Tabata only 18 or 19 years old?
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 17:32:01 GMT -5
No older than 19.
|
|
|
Post by jwmcc on Feb 23, 2007 18:19:13 GMT -5
. "The Yankees are literally being laughed at for the way they coddled him last year, and some scouts even wonder if he is hurt after all. And I agree, its a red flag to me."
Exactly, as I said last year, they're grooming him to be the next Jaret Wright. But at least he won't cost the Yankees 7 mil a year, at least starting out. Jw
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 18:41:06 GMT -5
Actually, they're trying to AVOID him becoming the next Jaret Wright. The idea is to NOT have him be an injury prone jerk who peaks at 21.
|
|
|
Post by drock2006 on Feb 23, 2007 20:20:32 GMT -5
I don't pay much attention to prospect reports, its impossible to know. Hell, 2 years ago the Yankee farm system was 'decimated".
Think a couple teams would want Cano and Wang? Cabrera is a nice 4th outfielder. Not even the yankees knew what they had in Cano until he hit the Bronx
|
|
|
Post by elliejay21 on Feb 23, 2007 22:08:00 GMT -5
This coddling of Hughes makes no sense to me. (The pussification of MLB?) I could see giving him more rest between starts, but if he is *healthy* pulling him with such a low pitch count will just train his arm to NOT have endurance.
|
|
MSBNYY
Administrator
El Guapo
Posts: 15,545
|
Post by MSBNYY on Feb 23, 2007 23:58:25 GMT -5
I think his age is an issue. Remember, coming out of HS, how many innings do you pitch? 50?
In 2005, Hughes WAS shut down due to arm issues as well. I'm sure fear of a Mark Prior/Kerry Wood issue was there. I can't blame them.
In 2006, they decided to be super cautious. I think the idea is 150 innings in 2006, 175 in 2007, and then 200 in 2008. If the guy throws 200 innings at age 22, why complain. I guess the idea is to get his body and arm used to the workload.
I do see the point about pussification though.
|
|
|
Post by drock2006 on Feb 24, 2007 9:44:03 GMT -5
I agree with the pussification, but this is baseball in 2007. Would you rather they not baby him and he end up like Liriano, Harden, Sheets, etc.
|
|